Position Memory at Catcher

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Greyfan
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Position Memory at Catcher

Post by Greyfan » Sun Feb 25, 2018 7:29 am

I have a player whose original position was catcher. He made the majors as a backup catcher but was a good enough hitter to be in the lineup so I played him at first. He quickly learned the position. Then it made sense to move him to third and he quickly learned that position. He was still the backup at catcher, playing between 15 and 50 games there every year.

Because I had lost a catcher who dropped below the league threshold for playing catcher in another league (so he couldn't rebuild his skills in the majors, and was too good a hitter to make it through waivers to relearn catching in the minors), I kept a close eye on this guy as his skill level dropped, even though he was still playing catcher every year, and when it got to the danger point, I made him the first string catcher. Even though he has played nowhere else for the past 5 years and 600+ games, he is still only a "B" at catcher, his original position. Ironically he is still an "A+" at 3rd, where he hasn't played an inning in 5 years, and at the same time has no rating at 1st, a position he hasn't played for 9 seasons. I understand the no rating at 1st, but I'm having trouble accepting both the "A+" at 3rd and more importantly how he could still be a "B" at catcher.

Granting catcher is by far the more difficult position, it still doesn't make sense to me that he could come up as a catcher, play catcher every year, a total (to date) of 1,031 games at catcher including one all star season, 483 at 3rd, and 245 at 1st, and have the position ratings he does. If there's a rule somewhere that explains this, I must have missed it. I also think if there is such a rule it's a bad one. I don't think a guy who progressed rapidly to "A+" levels at two positions would "forget" how to play his natural one, especially when he was playing some of the time there every season, and even if he did it would come back to him when he switched to full time.

Here's the guy:
http://www.simdynasty.com/player.jsp?id ... orimps=pos

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ballmark
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Re: Position Memory at Catcher

Post by ballmark » Sun Feb 25, 2018 8:23 am

I believe Age has everything to do with it. Once a player hits 33-34, their ability to learn (or re-learn, in this case) a "new" position goes straight to the dogs.

Muscle memory gets brittle in the Sim.
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Greyfan
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Re: Position Memory at Catcher

Post by Greyfan » Sun Feb 25, 2018 11:02 am

That's a pretty likely explanation. but I would argue it wasn't really a "new" position for him; he played some catcher every season up until he finally went full time at 33. Any other backup catcher, playing no other position but just sitting on the bench, would still be an A+, even with far less playing time at the position than my guy got. It doesn't seem to me that playing in the field at another position should be more detrimental to your muscle memory than not playing at all would be. Then there's the third base issue; even though he hasn't played there in five years, his muscle memory there is as high as it ever was. I take your point and it makes sense, but I still think something needs tweaking here.

LTJaeger
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Re: Position Memory at Catcher

Post by LTJaeger » Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:54 pm

These explanations are pretty accurate, but they don't address the problem.

Even worse, is that an older player who is A+ at catcher but occasionally backs up in the outfield, will LOSE catcher point during those backup appearances. This applies even if the guy is catching 110+ games per season and only playing a handful of games at other positions. It makes no sense, and would be good to address.

Slvanlae
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Re: Position Memory at Catcher

Post by Slvanlae » Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:07 am

I agree they should change this component as it relates to catcher

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Hamilton2
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Re: Position Memory at Catcher

Post by Hamilton2 » Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:21 pm

This is a well known issue that has been a reality for 15+ years. Catcher is the only position for hitters that even remotely matters in the sim. It is not likely to ever be fixed and it is on us to not let a catcher lose eligibility.

bahstonwedsawks
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Re: Position Memory at Catcher

Post by bahstonwedsawks » Mon Dec 17, 2018 8:22 pm

Hamilton2 wrote:
Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:21 pm
Catcher is the only position for hitters that even remotely matters in the sim.
This is incredibly incorrect. Defense is far more important than you realize and not just at catcher, Hamilton.
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Hamilton2
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Re: Position Memory at Catcher

Post by Hamilton2 » Mon Dec 17, 2018 8:48 pm

bahstonwedsawks wrote:
Mon Dec 17, 2018 8:22 pm
Hamilton2 wrote:
Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:21 pm
Catcher is the only position for hitters that even remotely matters in the sim.
This is incredibly incorrect. Defense is far more important than you realize and not just at catcher, Hamilton.
No it isn't. Less than 5% of the total parts in the sim are impacted by fielding. You wouldn't take as a ss an a/a fielder over an a-/a- if you gave up the same letter difference in either power or contact.

bahstonwedsawks
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Re: Position Memory at Catcher

Post by bahstonwedsawks » Mon Dec 17, 2018 9:35 pm

Hamilton2 wrote:
Mon Dec 17, 2018 8:48 pm
bahstonwedsawks wrote:
Mon Dec 17, 2018 8:22 pm
Hamilton2 wrote:
Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:21 pm
Catcher is the only position for hitters that even remotely matters in the sim.
This is incredibly incorrect. Defense is far more important than you realize and not just at catcher, Hamilton.
No it isn't. Less than 5% of the total parts in the sim are impacted by fielding. You wouldn't take as a ss an a/a fielder over an a-/a- if you gave up the same letter difference in either power or contact.
Sure, but to claim 5% as a percentage that doesn't even remotely matter is ridiculous. That is a meaningful percentage...especially in those 1-run games.
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WillyD
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Re: Position Memory at Catcher

Post by WillyD » Tue Dec 18, 2018 9:21 am

Hamilton2 wrote:
Mon Dec 17, 2018 8:48 pm
bahstonwedsawks wrote:
Mon Dec 17, 2018 8:22 pm
Hamilton2 wrote:
Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:21 pm
Catcher is the only position for hitters that even remotely matters in the sim.
This is incredibly incorrect. Defense is far more important than you realize and not just at catcher, Hamilton.
You wouldn't take a ss an a/a fielder over an a-/a- if you gave up the same letter difference in either power or contact.
If I had a good lineup already, and my defense wasn't that great, I'd consider it. (this is assuming the other skills/health/age are all equal)

When you consider + plays, lack of errors, and increased double play frequency over an entire season (SS and 2B get a ton of chances) it can certainly make up for a lot on offense. If you can get a guy to be productive offensively (either thru OBP or good power) with great defense at SS or 2B, then you have a piece of the championship puzzle.

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